this post was submitted on 17 Mar 2025
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I feel that “outgroup dumb” is shitposting but it’s from a real poll.

https://today.yougov.com/politics/articles/5057-understanding-how-marginal-taxes-work-its-all-part

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[–] rumba@lemmy.zip 16 points 7 hours ago

This is absolutely an educational failing. We barely cover taxes in school. At best it's said once in a class, gets covered in a minor question on a test and if we get it wrong, no one notices. "We" probably still got a B on the test without any CLUE how taxes work.

Yet here we are, dismantling any nationwide effort to make education better.

A LOT of people think 99,999 tax is 27,999 and 100,001 is 29,000, even on the democrat side. If those charts are accurate, it's probably damn close to 50% of US citizens.

[–] MordercaSkurwysyn@lemm.ee 8 points 6 hours ago

Where i live we have a system where if you take sick days, they are paid 80%. 20% reduction applies only to the days you were sick. Once I got sick at the end of a month and took the last 3 days of the month and first 2 days of the next one off and she freaked out I'm about to loose 20% of 2 month's salaries. She was and is still convinced that 20% deduction applies to a whole month worth of salary even if you take one day off that month. She almost never takes sick days and she works in a hospital... She self medicates and works with patients even when she has a transmittable diseases. Best of luck to those who have serious health problems and then get a fucking flu on top of everything from hospital staff. She is 60+ and reading the law to her doesn't change her mind. A couple years ago she had more serious health problems and took a week off for the first time in decades, even after getting a paycheck reduced only by 5% and not 20% her perception of this issue didn't change. She misunderstood that system once 40 years ago and she is going to take that misunderstanding to ger grave. Real world has no influence on her beliefs.

[–] Ronno@feddit.nl 5 points 6 hours ago

I'm just in awe about those 28% and 33% tax brackets. I'm in the 49,5% bracket here in The Netherlands. That being said, I'm fortunate to be in it.

[–] TheDoozer@lemmy.world 5 points 9 hours ago (1 children)

When you are talking large income to larger income, that makes total sense, but are there limits for access to things like child tax credits where if you go over you are no longer eligible, causing significant increase (I just looked, and it's at $200k single of $400k jointly, so unless you have A LOT of children, I suppose there wouldn't be a huge effect)? Similar to people on government assistance who go from getting full assistance to getting nothing at a certain income level?

[–] Apytele@sh.itjust.works 7 points 8 hours ago (1 children)

This is a big factor. A lot of people conflate less benefits with higher taxes because fear-brain just knows they both equal increased hardship in the end. They're technically wrong but their statistically slightly more active amygdalas are responding to a genuine threat, just one that they've been very skillfully misdirected into helping worsen.

[–] interdimensionalmeme@lemmy.ml 4 points 3 hours ago (1 children)

So an indoctrinated fear response that create a policy advantage for the very elites who created it.

Wow humans are so nice

[–] Apytele@sh.itjust.works 1 points 2 hours ago* (last edited 2 hours ago)

tbh the more I learn and experience that's most of the human experience. I had a Minister when I was young that said there's really only two human emotions, fear and love, and that without significant intervention fear pretty much always wins. I've been working in psychiatry for almost a decade now and there's lots of finer points to be made about human psychology but in the end it pretty much all does just boil down to fear and love.

He was an exceptionally good Minister, to the extent that for while I didn't understand how common it was for people to be deeply betrayed by a church leader. It was not uncommon for people in the community to genuinely compare him to Fred Rogers (who was incidentally also a Presbyterian minister). Very similar background, temperament, points of advocacy, and even appearance and mannerism; if they hadn't both been alive at the same time it almost might make me believe in reincarnation.

[–] joel_feila@lemmy.world 11 points 11 hours ago (1 children)

And this why democracy won't work. How can people votw in their best interests when they don't know how basic taxes work

[–] bearboiblake@pawb.social 1 points 10 hours ago

even if people were mega geniuses it wouldn't matter, money talks, and it talks a lot louder than people

[–] BedSharkPal@lemmy.ca 10 points 11 hours ago (2 children)
[–] SkyezOpen@lemmy.world 7 points 11 hours ago (1 children)

Don't need one. The amount of times I've had to explain how fucking tax brackets work, I wouldn't be surprised if the numbers were even more skewed towards the wrong answer.

[–] BedSharkPal@lemmy.ca 2 points 2 hours ago (1 children)

This is how missingormation spreads though. If something lines up with your existing worldview then you just assume it's true.

[–] chuymatt@startrek.website 1 points 2 hours ago

Trust but verify

[–] Carrot@lemmy.today 48 points 19 hours ago

This belief is held by many older folks due to propoganda, and it is passed down to their children when their parents teach them about taxes. Since almost all younger folks use automated tax services, if they aren't doing the math themselves, the fact that this isn't true isn't going to be discovered. I was taught the incorrect way when I was a kid, but noticed that it was wrong the first time I had to do my own taxes. But when I told my parents the way it actually worked, they didn't believe me until I showed them the .gov site that breaks it down. I grew up in a small, blue collar town, and every single person I talked to about taxes parroted the same incorrect system.

[–] AA5B@lemmy.world 3 points 11 hours ago

Thanks, Lemmy, now I’m “that Dad”. After reading this, I went to dinner with my two teens and one of their girlfriends, so of course I had to bring this up. All three have started working after school and will need to file their taxes this year so they need to know.

But holy crap is that a seriously uncool conversation

[–] PixelPilgrim@lemmings.world 2 points 10 hours ago

lol i wonder how much that is just guessing. they just coin flipped it

[–] billwashere@lemmy.world 4 points 12 hours ago (4 children)

Tell me you don’t know how income taxes work without telling me you don’t know how income taxes work.

My question is who does their taxes then?

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[–] dream_weasel@sh.itjust.works 13 points 17 hours ago (1 children)

How dumb do you have to be? By the time you make that much money you should, in theory, know the answer definitively or have a guy.

[–] rumba@lemmy.zip 2 points 7 hours ago

Almost everyone has a guy or uses some software. Those two things don't help them understand and this misconception of how taxes work is but a small sample of how people form political decisions without any viable understanding of the situation they're in or the repercussions of their actions.

Nobody's just making out a check for 30% and mailing it off to the IRS.

[–] w3dd1e@lemm.ee 69 points 1 day ago (39 children)

This is the problem. My partner doesn’t want to work OT because he thinks it will cost him more in taxes. I explain why that’s not exactly true, but I can tell he’s not interested. Financial Literacy in the US is abysmal.

[–] SkunkWorkz@lemmy.world 1 points 2 hours ago

it's just not the US. I live in the Netherland and many people here think OT and bonuses are taxed differently, because they see a higher tax rate applied to it on their slip. They forget that their base salary covers multiple brackets and a tax credit. Thus has a lower average tax rate than their OT and bonuses which falls in their top bracket or even a bracket above.

[–] Mossheart@lemmy.ca 6 points 9 hours ago

Tbh, literacy in the US, financial or otherwise is abysmal right now.

[–] sfu@lemm.ee 0 points 7 hours ago (2 children)

I've had jobs (more than one), where working OT would result in my paycheck take home pay being less than if I had not worked the extra hours. And that's because it moved me into the next bracket, and more taxes were taken out. So why waste my time working OT?

[–] Dnb@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 points 1 hour ago (1 children)

That's not how is works though.

I'd you made say 1500 normally and 2000 with ot your take home could be 1200 and 1400. Paying more taxes overall on the ot but still taking home more.

There is no way you'd take home less money because taxes are paid on the first $1500 @ $300 and say the next $500 @ $300 too at a higher bracket. Overall your pay is still higher though even though your taxes "doubled".

[–] sfu@lemm.ee 1 points 18 minutes ago

Well, it has happened more than once. Of course it would depend on the amount of overtime I worked. It probably happened if I only worked a little OT.

[–] GrosPapatouf@lemmy.world 3 points 6 hours ago (1 children)

I think you're on the wrong side of the chart here.

[–] spacesatan@leminal.space 1 points 6 hours ago

Or the person calculating their withholding was. But if you're paycheck to paycheck then that paycheck amount is all that really matters. Cool, I get a bigger refund eventually, but I'm now choosing between eating, walking 2 hours to work to save gas, or letting a bill go unpaid.

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