this post was submitted on 08 Nov 2023
552 points (93.4% liked)
Memes
45887 readers
1202 users here now
Rules:
- Be civil and nice.
- Try not to excessively repost, as a rule of thumb, wait at least 2 months to do it if you have to.
founded 5 years ago
MODERATORS
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
view the rest of the comments
You know their answer will be that the homeless just need to work harder.
And "stop doing drugs" as if homeless people are the only drug users and the rich never use them.
I've started getting angry when people declare that they refuse to give money to people begging because they'll just use it on drugs. More because of how frequently it comes up.
They aren't obliged to help anyone but just assuming every homeless person is a drug addict is so condescending.
And even if they were they are still a person and the money they beg for will is some part contribute to feeding them. You can't subsist off of drugs.
I see the same people burn money on the dumbest shit but act like giving money to homeless people is a sin against God.
If a homeless person is going to use that money for drugs or alcohol, good. I would too if I was homeless and needed to forget it for a little while.
What about people who are homeless because of drugs and alcohol? Is it morally justified to be codependent?
You've got it backwards. Drug addiction is a symptom of unfulfilled needs, not so much the other way around. See this short video on the "Rat Park Experiment".
No happy, fulfilled person is going to say one day "I think I'll go be a heroin addict." People who can't get their basic needs fulfilled use drugs (and other addictive things) as a substitute for the fulfilling things they can't access for other reasons.
Here is an alternative Piped link(s):
this short video on the "Rat Park Experiment"
Piped is a privacy-respecting open-source alternative frontend to YouTube.
I'm open-source; check me out at GitHub.
Can you explain how never giving a homeless person any money will elevate them from their plight?
If not, then giving them money is, at worst, incidental and, at best, an improvement to their situation.
I don’t give money to homeless people anymore.
I used to work near a shelter and I’d get chased and harassed for money, I got threatened and yelled at regularly, and I got mugged once. Now being around the homeless makes me incredibly uneasy.
I donate to food banks and the shelters, but no way am I ever giving some unaccountable homeless person cash. If they want my help they can go through the proper channels, I know many won’t, but I don’t have the tools to find or help those people.
And you're not obliged to. There's nothing immoral about not going out of your way to help people especially at risk to yourself.
While they are people and should be treated with dignity and not like animals, they are still people and like any stranger can be dangerous and unpredictable, especially in desperation.
Not to mention at least near where I live about a third of the homeless are mentally ill due to the state's incapacity to care for such people.
It's similar where I live.
I feel bad mainly supporting the shelters because there are a lot of stories about people who go in and get robbed or assaulted and they avoid them after. They tend to build camps which get perennially torn down by the city/cops. I wish there was a better way to help those people.
The only reason not to give food, clothing, or cash is because I’m already late for work or I have nothing to spare right now. I try to find something even if it’s just a smoke or something.
Assuming those other people are all bad or at the very least less than the good people?
Using that as a reason to not help people? And love sharing it?
Using the same money on dumb wasteful shit for yourself?
I think the people you’re running into are just run of the mill conservatives.
I seriously think that being drug use enabler is not a good thing. If you know that particular homeless person has drugs problem better buy him a sandwich or give warm clothes than give money.
https://www.spokesman.com/stories/2023/oct/18/in-kirkland-and-across-us-working-people-are-livin/
Are you posting these links in reply to me because you think I am suggesting the homeless need to work harder?
No just resources, if you had that conversation with a coworker.
Thanks, sorry for the misinterpretation!
All good!
https://abc7news.com/jane-parisi-oakland-homeless-two-jobs-woman-works-population/4497369/
Luckily they unionized..
Exactly that. Homelessness isn't a social issue that needs to be solved, it's the consequences of the unhomed's poor choices and absolutely nothing else.
Arguing with willful ignorance is fucking exhausting, you literally can't get them to see past their blind beliefs because most of them wear "you can't change my mind" like a badge of honor.
It is a social issue. People being incapable of taking care of themselves is inevitable. All civilizations had these issues. Families, churches and general generosity of neighbors have always been used to mitigate this.
Now with the wealth gap increasing and the individualistic philosophy in our society with not noticing and tending to these early on. We only notice once the person is a full blown junkie. Many needed help for a a short moment in life and could of become autonomous after, many are both permanently incapable of autonomy. Either way society have to deal with them. We have enough resources! For the price of just one of those opulent pick up we could probably shelter one person for 2-5 years.
Not so much willful ignorance as backwards reasoning. They desperately want to believe the world is fair and they earned whatever success they've had in their lives, so they adopt beliefs that lead to those conclusions.
I struggled with it a lot in my 20s. If you've grown up with the idea that the world is basically a pretty decent place, it's hard to accept how fucked up everything is, so there's a natural tendency to try to explain away the things you learn about so you don't have to confront the harsh reality directly.
Classical Liberal / Libertarian here and this is wrong. Life can be massively unfair / unkind and it's not unusual for people, even ones who make solid choices, to end up in bad situations.
What so many of my Libertarian fellows seem to miss is that we're allowed to have empathy. Do I want the Government taking my money to redistribute it? Absolutely not but that does not excuse us from acting on our own. In fact I'd argue we have MORE of an obligation for individual action to help those less fortunate.
Come at me.