this post was submitted on 18 Dec 2023
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submitted 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) by Loucypher@lemmy.ml to c/linux@lemmy.ml
 

Long story short, I have a desktop with Fedora, lovely, fast, sleek and surprisingly reliable for a near rolling distro (it failed me only once back around Fedora 34 or something where it nuked Grub). Tried to install on a 2012 i7 MacBook Air… what a slog!!!!! Surprisingly Ubuntu runs very smooth on it. I have been bothering all my friends for years about moving to Fedora (back then it was because I hated Unity) but now… I mean, I know that we are suppose to hate it for Snaps and what not but… Christ, it does run well! In fairness all my VMs are running DietPi (a slimmed version of Ubuntu) and coming back to the APT world feels like coming back home.

On the other end forcing myself to be on Fedora allows me to stay on the DNF world that is compatible with Amazon Linux etc (which I use for work), it has updated packages, it is nice and clean…. Argh, don’t know how to decide!

Thoughts?

I am not in the mood for Debian. I like the Mint approach but I am not a fan of slow rolling releases and also would like to keep myself as close as upstream as possible, the Debian version is the only one that seems reliable enough but, again, it is Debian, the packages are “old”. Pop Os and similar are two hops away from upstream and so I’d rather not.

Is Snap really that bad?

Edit: thank you all for sharing your experience !

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[–] CrabAndBroom@lemmy.ml 5 points 10 months ago

Personally I don't really hate Ubuntu, but I tend to find that everything it does, there's something else that does it slightly better.

For example, it's supposed to be a good 'beginner' distro or good for something that 'just works', but IMO things like Mint or Pop!OS do it a little better these days. Snap is supposed to be a nice simple way to manage packages without worrying about dependencies, but Flatpak does it better and so on.

So yeah I don't hate it, I just don't see any particular reason to really use it. Opinions may vary though of course.

[–] LoveSausage@lemmy.ml 4 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (2 children)

Long time since I used Ubuntu,, remember updates breaking network twice.. Peppermint OS, Debian(and devuan if you don't like systemd) based. all the important bits (not arch level) but nothing more. Rolling, Runs on 1 GB ram. Haven't distro hopped anymore since I found it.

Stable base , extra on top

“Everything you need and nothing you don’t."

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[–] Decker108@lemmy.ml 4 points 10 months ago (3 children)

I think a lot of people dislike Ubuntu because of Gnome and Snaps, which is weird to me. You can fairly easily change desktop environment and most Snaps have apt or Flatpak alternatives.

[–] erwan@lemmy.ml 2 points 10 months ago

It's just simpler to pick a distribution that matches your choices out of the box, rather than hacking a distro. And I'm talking about Snap in particular.

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[–] ethd@beehaw.org 4 points 10 months ago

I've run Ubuntu Server frequently on VMs for work, but I could kinda go either way on it. The majority of people who have issues with Ubuntu have philosophical differences. I'm inclined to agree for my personal stuff (in principle I'd rather not get my packages from a single source that works on their own whims, in practice I never use anything but Flathub unless I need a package with deeper permissions) primarily because I believe that Linux should be as open as possible. That said, I already mentioned that my principles there only apply to machines I own, so I guess I'm a bit of a hypocrite 😅

[–] danielfgom@lemmy.world 3 points 10 months ago (1 children)

If it works for you then use it, however if you want the latest packages you'll have to NOT use the LTS releases in which case be prepared to do a FULL REINSTALL every time a new version comes out.

Or use the LTS but use Snaps for those applications that you want to have the latest versions of. Snaps are getting better and I think eventually you won't notice the difference between them and native apps, except for the space they just up. But that goes for Flatpak too.

Personally I use Linux Mint Debian Edition because I'm not happy with the way Canonical is going. In most cases the "old" apps are fine for me, but if I felt need the newest version I'll use a Flatpak.

Another rolling option is OpenSuse Tumbleweed however, being a Mac which uses proprietary WiFi drivers, your WiFi will break with kernel updates, which can be irritating, unless you have ethernet.

[–] _edge@discuss.tchncs.de 2 points 10 months ago (2 children)

If it works for you then use it, however if you want the latest packages you’ll have to NOT use the LTS releases in which case be prepared to do a FULL REINSTALL every time a new version comes out.

This is just wrong. You can update the LTS release to the next non-LTS release. You only have to unchecked "LTS only". You can also wait for the next LTS release.

You never need a full install. I haven't done such a thing for a decade.

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[–] polographer@lemm.ee 3 points 10 months ago

I recently got a workstation class desktop for my home server and I had so many issues with Debian that I have to search an alternative, Ubuntu supported the hardware natively and I even got a firmware update. I think the hate is really unfounded. Of course there is corporate decisions, but so far it has never get in my way. I have it with a lot of docker containers and a lot hardware integrations. Even the secure boot with nvdia card is easy. I only installed virt-manager via snap, the other things were directly with apt. I did enable the live patch and that’s a nice addition to don’t need to restart a lot.

I think you should give it a try, so far it has worked for me.

[–] electric_nan@lemmy.ml 3 points 10 months ago (1 children)

I'm quite happy with Linux Mint Debian Edition. I think it is the future of Mint. It's on a very recent kernel, and more and more software I use nowadays is in Flatpaks anyways. I don't feel like I'm missing out on much new stuff, but maybe I'm just not aware.

[–] dan@upvote.au 1 points 10 months ago (1 children)

How different is it from regular Debian? Like if I'm very experienced with Debian, does that equate to being able to easily use Mint Debian Edition too?

[–] electric_nan@lemmy.ml 2 points 10 months ago

I found normal Debian to be a little unpolished for my liking. Even using the Cinnamon DE, it was lacking some niceties that Mint brings. I don't think you'll have any trouble using Mint.

[–] jimmy90@lemmy.world 3 points 10 months ago

i heard all this shit about linux and nvidia

i installed Ubuntu and EVERYTHING WORKS

[–] skullgiver@popplesburger.hilciferous.nl 3 points 10 months ago (1 children)

You don't have to use Snap (except for LXC, I think?). It's not enabled by default, but you can enable Flatpak and everything will work fine. Flatpak has Firefox and Chrome and all the other applications thst Canonical foolishly moved from their apt repos to their Snap repos.

There are some frustrating things about Snaps (loading all of them at boot time rather than at runtime, for quicker app start but slower boot, for example, and that stupid snap folder that can't be moved) but honestly I don't really see what the fuss is about as an end user. Nobody sets up a purely Snap based system anyway.

The problem with Snap is an ideological one. If you don't care who runs your software store and if you don't care about having the ability to add more software stores then the default, you'll be fine with Snap. If you're ideologically driven towards Linux, you'll probably dislike the way Snap is set up.

Like it or not, Ubuntu is still one of the best supported distros out there. If you want drivers from any manufacturer, you get to pick between drivers tested for Ubuntu or Fedora. Every other distro repackages those drivers using their own scripts and compatibility layers because nobody over at Intel is going to spend company time specifically getting Garuda to work when its customers don't sell hardware with it preinstalled.

Software like Discord and VS Code having the ".deb, maybe .rpm, or you figure it out yourself" approach of official distribution is pretty standard, I'd say, for better or for worse. It also helps that a lot of entry level Linux questions and answers online are about Ubuntu. Askubuntu may not be as vast and up to date as the Arch wiki, but at least the askubuntu people aren't going to tell you off for not knowing advanced Linux stuff.

There are upsides and downsides to any Linux distro. You're not "supposed" to think anything, try it out, keep an open mind, and pick what works for you.

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[–] ipsirc@lemmy.ml 2 points 10 months ago

*buntu doesn't even deserve threads like this.

[–] mp3@lemmy.ca 2 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

There is some stuff that I hate, but I tend to come back to it for my home server just because of livepatch, which is nice to minimize the amount of reboots necessary and having a patched kernel for all my LXCs makes then also automatically protected.

[–] JoeKrogan@lemmy.world 1 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

I used to use Ubuntu before unity and switched to Debian 👑 in 2012. I still have to use Ubuntu for work and I just get on with it. It could be worse.... I could have to use windows.

Anyway my main gripes with Ubuntu are snaps and how they keep swapping packages in apt to be installed as snaps .

I dont hate it, its a tool and in most cases I can use it and there is no problem if not there are other options.

[–] octatron@lmy.drundo.com.au 1 points 10 months ago (1 children)

Is nixos very upstream? I kinda like the idea of creating an immutable script that assembles my os just how I like, configured installed and ready with flatpaks for apps so they're all sitting securely in their respective boxes. I think this is also Chris Fishers preference as well ;)

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