this post was submitted on 03 Mar 2025
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No Stupid Questions

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I'm an immigrant working in the USA, I came here because of the promise of a better tomorrow, a meritocracy, a seat at the table at big tech, and for a while it felt real but then my company was acquired by a larger entity and it all went to shit, now I'm in a race to show I'm the most competent and dedicated person with the most technological knowledge to keep my job and not get layed off.

If I ask my manager or my director a question or challenge their thought process I get called into a 1 on 1 meeting where I'm told I'm a great asset to the team but me asking questions of them in a team setting sets a bad example, and my questions aren't in bad faith infact in the meeting I was lauded for asking the right questions, but being pulled aside and being asked to kiss the ring felt disgusting.

At one point in my career I cared about what I did and who I worked for I felt pride over my product and my team, and all I feel now is shame to be associated with my company, I feel disgusted with myself that I work not for my customers but for shareholder value.

So I guess my question if any is are there still companies that exist in the USA or outside that still give a fuck about what they're doing and not just inflate that companies value so it can be sold or keep the stock price going up.

I would love to live and work somewhere where my value isn't determined by how much money I van make or how much shareholder value I increase, I wouldn't have to worry about a visa and if I can/will be kicked out if I'm no longer employed.

I could go back home but the work culture there is atrocious it was the reason why I had left, I lasted 5 months and I couldn't take it and put in my 2 weeks to go to the US for a Masters degree in Computer Sciences.

I'm sorry that this turned into more of a rant than anything else but I'm at a point where I don't really know what I want to do anymore, any advice or conversation is appreciated.

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[–] shaggyb@lemmy.world 8 points 2 days ago (1 children)

I hope you find your way to a civilized country.

[–] tpyoman@lemmy.world 1 points 2 days ago
[–] webghost0101@sopuli.xyz 28 points 3 days ago* (last edited 3 days ago) (2 children)

I recognize that this is a very different angle but there is a global trend for free open source software which are non profit by design.

Of course this basically means you need to be a developer and than there is still the question about how to survive within economic society.

I doubt you want to live from donations coming from where you are now.

The sweet spot, which might be viable for you is an open source devision within a for profit company. Many industries have started to understand the massive value of open source software and standards. Companies like redhat build open source tools on one side but then sell industry tailored packages and support to enterprises for profit. Even Nvidia has started to open source some level of their drivers because they realized that enthusiast will often improve on those for zero costs.

I imagine in some of those divisions its just like a normal company with not just devs but all kinda of roles your direct product will be used by the for profit stuff but also be free for everyone else out there that might need it.

[–] jagged_circle@feddit.nl 1 points 2 days ago (1 children)
[–] JustEnoughDucks@feddit.nl 2 points 2 days ago* (last edited 2 days ago) (1 children)

Open-source hardware is almost non-existant compared to software. There is a reason for it.

I am an electronics engineer who makes open source hardware as a hobby.

Hardware is extremely different from software. It requires substantial monetary investment.

My company last year did a dirt-cheap lowest-possible-budget prototype design and run of 10 for someone funding themselves independently. It cost 8000€ for the design and that one prototype run, and an extremely simple design at that (electronically, medical-spec mechanically).

Software you buy a system and you can develop and develop and iterate and test 1000 times and develop multiple projects on that single machine. If you sell 0 units, sure you are out a computer and a ton of personal time. Sucks, but you won't lose your house.

If you do electronics + mechanical development, every time you iterate on the electronics, that will be 200€-1000€ please, plus test equipment. If you make a small mistake equivalent to a wrong pointer that is another 1000 down the drain.

Hardware projects, pure material-wise, can cost more than a car to develop (just going through CE and FCC compliance testing can be 2k-10k and you aren't allowed to sell in the EU without it.

You need capital to burn or be OK with a non-market-ready end product. Most people would rather make a down payment on a house than develop open hardware that might never recoup just the material costs. You can't just give the hardware away for free unlike software also.

[–] jagged_circle@feddit.nl 1 points 2 days ago (1 children)

The key for open source hardware is crowd funding. Source: I've run an open source hardware company for years.

[–] JustEnoughDucks@feddit.nl 2 points 1 day ago (1 children)

That is very cool, I have never met someone who had success with open hardware. Can I ask what the company is?

Any tips for doing crowd funding if I decide to put my stuff on the market? I feel like crowd funding has died off a lot in comparison with 10 years ago since most campaigns either don't reach the goal, don't deliver the product (or a very basis version), or were scams to begin with.

[–] jagged_circle@feddit.nl 2 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago)

Nope, but there's loads of open hardware on Crowd Supply

https://www.crowdsupply.com/browse

100% of campaigns on Crowd Supply have delivered after having been funded (their entire history). Its a very good platform for both maker and backer.

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[–] theneverfox@pawb.social 11 points 2 days ago (3 children)

IDK if this would be viable with an H1 visa and I've seen many other options I'll be looking into, but here's what I normally tell people in this position: small businesses are built different

They're harder to find, they usually don't pay amazingly, but they're way more human. It's not all run through spread sheets, you work for humans who get to know you and (can sometimes) actually be like a family...(If they say that phrase it's a red flag though)

It's hit or miss, you likely would be working on legacy stuff or have to wear many hats... But it's work where you know what you're doing and who you're doing it for

[–] Yaky@slrpnk.net 4 points 2 days ago (1 children)

It really depends on the business.

I worked for two smaller businesses (team of ≤ 10 software developers). One was mismanaged, ran by very unpleasant people, and abusive towards employees, resulting in a huge turnover and a "dead sea effect". The other company got government grants because the owner's relative was a politician, and had ridiculous surveillance software on developers' machines.

Ironically, the most "human" and enjoyable work I did was working on internal legacy software and code rewrites for a huge corporation before and during their move towards agile and modern "conveyorized" approach to software.

[–] theneverfox@pawb.social 2 points 2 days ago

Oh absolutely... There's tons of petty tyrants out there too, which is different, but also bad or even worse. They might also be just staffing something just as soul crushing too, so it could just be worse in every regard

But small business means your boss is probably there to stay. Ideally, you meet the owner in your interview, often they're the same person. But if you find someone loyal to their people, you can actually give them your loyalty and they'll see you as a person

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[–] carl_dungeon@lemmy.world 23 points 3 days ago (4 children)

I’ve worked for a small business in tech for 15 years- it’s a great company that cares for its people. I think some of what you’re describing is just the nature of larger companies. The bigger the machine, the smaller the cog.

[–] PP_BOY_@lemmy.world 13 points 3 days ago (4 children)

More to this point, it comes down to who owns the company, meaning the shares. Fiduciary responsibility is a real thing and is responsible for some of the worst things going on in the world right now.

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[–] algorithmae@lemmy.sdf.org 14 points 3 days ago (1 children)

If I ask my manager or my director a question or challenge their thought process I get called into a 1 on 1 meeting where I'm told I'm a great asset to the team but me asking questions of them in a team setting sets a bad example

This isn't on you. If you manager's skin is so thin that they can't take some critical thinking thrown at them, then they shouldn't be a manager. Though if you're doing it all the time it's probably very annoying. If they're doing some self-destructive braindead company decisions, then just roll your eyes and don't say anything while waiting for their comeuppance to bite them in the ass. You don't have to kiss the ring but you don't have to be a nuisance either.

So I guess my question if any is are there still companies that exist in the USA or outside that still give a fuck about what they're doing and not just inflate that companies value so it can be sold or keep the stock price going up.

Maybe a small business with decent core values. They are very rare though, and are liable to be eaten alive by a change in management. So basically no.

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[–] BeefPiano@lemmy.world 17 points 3 days ago (2 children)

I have a couple decades experience as a software engineer and manager. I don’t know if you’re ready to hear my answer, but here it is:

You might be in a bad situation, it’s hard to say with a single data point. There are bad bosses out there and it can be a nightmare, even at a good company. The “easy” fix is to try working on a different team or a different company and see if that solves the issue. Easy is in quotes because, as an immigrant, it may be tough to move to another employer.

The harder answer is to look inside yourself.

Your title asks about non-capitalistic companies. There are non-profits, but I don’t think capitalism is your problem here. You’re still going to run into problems at non-profits or even volunteering in open source if you aren’t able to integrate well with teams.

There are always going to be cultural expectations no matter where you go. The situation you described about having a 1:1 over asking questions suggests you either have an overly sensitive manager or your manager is right and you are not effective with your feedback. Asking questions can open up conversations or be used to bully people you disagree with.

The way you disagree matters. It’s not enough to be right, you need to persuade other people to be right too. As a manager, I’m focused on the team’s output and if one person is causing problems with the group dynamic, I’m going to address it.

I’m hiring right now and have passed on candidates who fall into the “brilliant jerk” stereotype. There’s research that shows that those types drag the rest of the team down. Remember, I’m focused on the entire team, so any one person needs to fit into that context.

If you find that your interpersonal skills need a boost, “How to Win Friends and Influence People” has good advice but it’s hard for some people to accept advice like “let other people be wrong when it doesn’t matter” and “compliment people.”

The other thing I’m reading in your post is that you may be burned out. The classic solutions for that are therapy, rest, exercise, and investing in life outside work. It’s hard to spot burnout sometimes, but check in with your support group.

So that’s 3 options forward: change your situation, improve your skills, or rest up and recover from burnout. Good luck.

[–] tpyoman@lemmy.world 5 points 3 days ago* (last edited 3 days ago) (2 children)

Thank you for your comment, I really appreciate you taking the time and your analysis, I'm not sure if its relavant but by th3 end of the 1 on 1 the director apologized to me when they realized that what i had asked actually furthered the conversation and that they were hurt that I would make that statement at the time and in that group as they felt I was just digging up old corpses, when they were explained my thought process and what I meant and what I asked and that the point of that statement was to ensure we dont fall into the same pitfalls again, I was calm and kind in the meeting. I do agree I think i have been burned out for a bit and this whole situation felt bad, and I do agree that this is an industry/employement thing that I can't really escape from.

And the other thing is I dont want to have to influence people to do my job, I dont want to have to walk on eggshells if i need to get someyhig done I'm an engineer my job is to give you the logic and the solution, they are th3 managers/directors and they need to facilitate my job, not tell me that me asking about our environment strategy and avoiding teams in silos is something they should feel offended by.

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[–] BaroqueInMind@lemmy.one 4 points 3 days ago

This is some of the best advice I've ever read on lemmy. Thank you!

[–] kayazere@feddit.nl 11 points 3 days ago* (last edited 3 days ago) (2 children)

One answer to capitalist companies seeking to maximize profit at all costs are worker owned companies. When the workers are in control of the business decisions, they won’t vote for the decisions going against themselves.

Sadly, I don’t know that many worked owned tech companies. One example is https://www.igalia.com/

If more people would be willing to start work owned companies rather than your typical capitalist startup, we could have more options.

[–] kayazere@feddit.nl 10 points 3 days ago (1 children)
[–] tpyoman@lemmy.world 2 points 2 days ago

Thanks!! I didn't know of this resource will check it out.

[–] jagged_circle@feddit.nl 1 points 2 days ago (1 children)
[–] kayazere@feddit.nl 3 points 2 days ago

I believe Valve just has a flat hierarchy, but not worker owned.

[–] jagged_circle@feddit.nl 4 points 2 days ago (1 children)
[–] tpyoman@lemmy.world 2 points 2 days ago

Yep I'm going to look at non profits and also look at unions as well.

[–] NeoNachtwaechter@lemmy.world 10 points 3 days ago* (last edited 3 days ago) (7 children)

but being pulled aside and being asked to kiss the ring felt disgusting.

You are absolutely right here. It is a very shitty boss. They can happen everywhere, but still not all are like that one.

I am an expert in my field, too, and I would have my way of withstanding such a guy. Not sure, however, if it is possible in Usa. I am in Germany.

are there still companies that exist in the USA or outside that still give a fuck about what they're doing and not just inflate that companies value

There are. At least here. The work culture is much better in general (but very different between companies), because such single specimen of asshole bosses are not that powerful here. Firing somebody is a regulated process, and things can be reviewed later by independent people, in the company or in court.

As long as companies are not that huge, they usually care better about what they are doing.

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[–] twistypencil@lemmy.world 7 points 3 days ago* (last edited 3 days ago) (1 children)

There are non profits, that is about it for this capitalistic hell scape. You do not need to volunteer at them, plenty have actual jobs. They can't pay market rate, but more of a non profit rate, but it's not bad

[–] tpyoman@lemmy.world 5 points 3 days ago

Yep I shall look into non profits and try my luck to see if I can land a job there.

[–] Ziggurat@fedia.io 5 points 3 days ago (1 children)

Government services aren't company, and some do develop technology, place like US national institute of Health, or US NASA, or US department of Energy come to my mind, but any first world nation would have tons of similar things. As usual doesn't mean there is no bullshit to deal with (You know the saying about reserarcher main job is to look for fundings)

Then there is FOSS sofware some of them being managed by non profit who can afford to pay their developers

finally, there is a whole non profit/charity/coop part of the economy, and considering the weigh of technology, you may have some jobs linked to technology. (But managing let's say the "red cross ERP" sounds as awful as managing any other corporate ERP)

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[–] Kaboom@reddthat.com 4 points 3 days ago (6 children)

By definition, no. You can volunteer for a non profit, like the Linux foundation, but you won't make much money.

[–] jagged_circle@feddit.nl 1 points 2 days ago

So its a yes then

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[–] paequ2@lemmy.today 3 points 3 days ago (2 children)

At one point in my career I cared about what I did and who I worked for I felt pride over my product and my team, and all I feel now is shame to be associated with my company, I feel disgusted with myself that I work not for my customers but for shareholder value.

This tracks with my experience here as well.

keep my job and not get layed off.

For me, it seems like falling in line and kissing the ring is more important than showing ability, if you want to avoid being laid off. At a previous job, I got laid off before my very noob coworker who took months to complete PRs because I wouldn't shut my mouth about RTO.

a meritocracy

🌎🧑‍🚀🔫🧑‍🚀 Never has been.

[–] Bullshit@piefed.social 2 points 2 days ago (1 children)

People still falling for that meritocracy stuff lol

[–] tpyoman@lemmy.world 2 points 2 days ago

Yea after working in the USA I was disillusioned fairly quickly when I was stepped over for promotions by people that knew somebody who knows somebody.

It's all about who you know and how you know them.

[–] tpyoman@lemmy.world 2 points 2 days ago

Yep that's my understanding as well, fall in line or you're out.

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