this post was submitted on 15 Jan 2025
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In an unexpected mask off "secure" email and VPN provider Proton took the stance of siding with the fascist MAGA Reps. Proton's services are no option for me and many others any longer. Let's collect and discuss alternatives (E2E encrypted email and VPN) here πŸ”πŸ‘‡

Always try to provide:

-Server location (jurisdiction)

-Governance

-Integrity/trustworthiness/transparency

-User experience/ease of use (grade 1 to 10, lets take Proton as a benchmark with an 8)

-Pricing and links

If you know alternative setups, feel free to share, too.

#ProtonExodus

Background: https://lemmy.ca/comment/13913116

Edit:typo

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[–] ShotDonkey@lemmy.world 34 points 1 week ago (4 children)

OK I think I will move to Posteo. Great security, privacy focussed, servers in Germany, running with 100% renewable energy. Prices are ok, too. Ticks all boxes.

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[–] _LordMcNuggets_@feddit.org 32 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (3 children)

Maybe not the contribution that you're looking for, but going to tell you this story regardless.

I am Swiss, and am a former Department of Foreign Affairs (FDFA / EDA) employee. My colleagues and I had organized an evening on cybersecurity, where we showcase what Switzerland has to offer. I invited stakeholders such as:

  • Dreamlab (really cool company, should look them up if you don't know of them)
  • NCSC (Swiss National Cyber Security Center)
  • Some Swiss cyber regulator; and
  • Proton

Firstly, when speaking to a delegate of one of the above listed (don't feel comfortably sharing publicly which one), he ushered a statement; upon me saying I'm a huge Proton fan and subscribed to all services - "they are lying to your faces".

I was curious, so I spoke with the regulators and NCSC delegates, they said that Proton has been involved in a handful of leaks - some that were made public, some behind the scenes.

When I spoke to Andy, having told him that I grew up in Canada, I asked him what his plan was for North America. His response: "I will gladly take their money, but never open up shop there - too many national security departments that come knocking on the door".

Now I see that (on the Proton page), that they are looking for a few US based positions for Marketing and Growth - going against what we discussed a few years back. In all honesty, I still have a Plus subscription with them, but beginning to questions a lot more things regarding security and ethics at Proton. Guess I'll just self-host in the future. Trust no one but yourself with your personal data.

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[–] AnAmericanPotato@programming.dev 31 points 1 week ago (3 children)

Tuta.com is similar to Proton Mail + Calendar.

  • Location: Germany

  • Governance: Private GmbH (German corporation, similar to an American LLC)

  • Integrity/trustworthiness/transparency: Better than Proton IMHO. All their apps are open source and available on F-Droid. They encrypt email headers (unlike Proton, who are weaselly about this in their marketing materials).

  • User Experience: Ehhhh...6? I'm not in the best position to compare because I do not have a premium plan, so I am not able to examine features like inbox rules/filters. Much like Proton, it doesn't support full-text email search unless you have it cache your entire mailbox locally (either via the web site or app). They do not support POP or IMAP, but do offer their own desktop and mobile apps.

  • Pricing: €3/month for 20GB, €8/month for 500GB. https://tuta.com/pricing

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[–] 9488fcea02a9@sh.itjust.works 29 points 1 week ago (2 children)

Tweet is from early december. Why is it blowing up now?

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[–] sma3in@lemmy.world 28 points 1 week ago (1 children)

I just got settled for fuck's sake

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[–] Nicro@discuss.tchncs.de 28 points 1 week ago (3 children)

I'm currently on Tuta, because I can't imagine Mail without a free tier. It's run out of Germany(EU). Its 3€ a month for the normal tier, free takes away most features. Like Proton, you need to use their (OSS)-Client, for encryption reasons. It's currently growing and I hope they don't go crazy anytime soon.

I was looking at Posteo, but I don't want my entire internet identity to be gone, if I ever can't pay for it.

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[–] hddsx@lemmy.ca 27 points 1 week ago (6 children)

I don’t use proton, but I would be grateful if you could share a link on how Proton sided with fascists.

Also, I use Mullvad for VPN and I host my own email

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[–] Perhapsjustsniffit@lemmy.ca 25 points 1 week ago (6 children)

Uggghhh I just upped for two years. Fucking asshats are all caving to the orange fuckhead. Probably off to Europe somewhere.

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[–] ngn@lemmy.ml 24 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (8 children)

this idea of if you use a product you have to support every belief the company have is absolutely insane, like why can't you recognize that a company's products and it's beliefs are two separate things? yeah the beliefs do effect the product but not all of them (especially not in this case like bro its ceos personal belief), why are we living in a time where you either have to %100 support something or you have %100 be against it? the fact that even a small political stand that someone dont agree with can turn them against a company or even a person is crazy to me

anyway i understand you made this choice and even tho i dont agree with the reasoning ill also provide 2 alternatives for vpn: mullvad and ivpn, both dont require email for account creation and accept monero payment, you probably heard them before

for email i suggest hosting your own if you have the time, there is this great project named docker-mailserver and its really easy to setup, but if you dont want to go through the effort feel free to check numerous alternatives others provided

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[–] nightm4re@feddit.org 24 points 1 week ago (10 children)

I've said it in another thread: German users should consider posteo as a green, safe, and affordable (1€/M) alternative. https://posteo.de/de

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[–] shadejinx@lemmy.world 22 points 1 week ago

I think I would wait for changes in their mission and policies before I start moving anything.

[–] Siathes@lemmy.dbzer0.com 22 points 1 week ago (7 children)

Sooo, can we not create and/or finance our own? Please be gentle…but…is there not enough of us paying for proton and other privacy apps to fund a floss or non-profit version? I mean there are tech nerds all over this place, along with law nerds and political nerds…etc..(meant with love btw) that would have an instant user base.

I pledge here to sub up to $15usd/month for any lemmy person that starts an entity that provides us with what we need with ethics and morality of lemmy common.

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[–] zdhzm2pgp@lemmy.ml 20 points 1 week ago* (last edited 6 days ago)

AFAICT, it looks like all he's doing is praising πŸ„'s pick for AG in the Antitrust division . . . although if you look over her Wikipedia page, you're right, it doesn't look all that encouraging.

Can someone on Mastodon ask the Proton CEO what it was exactly that she did that he likes so much? Anyone who can work at Fox for any length of time, frankly, is complete and utter shite.

EDIT: Also, just as a broken clock can be right twice a day, πŸ„ sank the Trans Pacific Partnership, which was the right thing to do, but for the wrong reason: mainly to get back at Obama for existing. So in the same way, I suppose it's possible that Slater did something good, but I'd sure like to know what it was.

[–] TCB13@lemmy.world 20 points 1 week ago (8 children)

This is amazing. People were perfectly okay with ignoring all the red flags in Proton and their products and really okay with buying all their bullshit, then a tweet saying Trump comes up and that's it. lol

[–] RubberElectrons@lemmy.world 31 points 1 week ago (6 children)

🀷 sometimes people grumble quietly until a final straw is added to the stack. Not surprising.

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[–] schnapspraline@lemmy.world 18 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (8 children)

My personal recommendations:

https://uberspace.de/

  • Server location (jurisdiction): Germany
  • Integrity/trustworthiness/transparency: About-Page
  • User experience/ease of use (grade 1 to 10, lets take Proton as a benchmark with an 8): 6
  • Pricing: Based on solidarity, but recommend minimum is 5 € per month

https://www.hostsharing.net/

  • Server location (jurisdiction): Germany
  • Integrity/trustworthiness/transparency: well, you own part of hostsharing if you use it (collective-ownership)
  • User experience/ease of use (grade 1 to 10, lets take Proton as a benchmark with an 8): 6
  • Pricing: 64 € onetime payment + 10 € per month (cooperative)

Other recommendations:

  • mailbox.org, systemli.org, riseup.net, posteo.de (as far as I know all of them are located in Germany)
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[–] Yerbouti@sh.itjust.works 18 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (3 children)

Nextcloud is an amazing alternative to things like google suite or Office365. You can.self-host it or rent space on a server with nextcloud preinstalled. It integrates things like file storage, online office, podcast, rss feed reader, photo albums, etc. There's litteraly hundreds of apps that can easily be installed. I was a big user of the G suite, made the change last year and couldn't be happier. It's much more powerful than I was expecting and no evil gafam get access to my data.

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