this post was submitted on 01 Oct 2023
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What is the level of detail possible for 1:72 figures with PLA? (obsolete) (diyrpg.org)
submitted 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) by Yora@diyrpg.org to c/3dprinting@lemmy.world
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(I've been informed that I had been told complete BS by the person trying to tell me that resin printing 1:72 wargame minis would be stupidly expensive. As such, my question here is no longer relevant.)

I am considering the option to get back into miniature painting by starting with 3D printing my own custom figures.

Given the price difference, it would have to be plastic (I read PLA is a good option), and for my purposes it would mostly be 1:72 scale figures.

The deciding factor is whether at such a small scale PLA can achieve a level of detail that doesn't look completely terrible. I'm used to 1:72 injection mold figures, and my previous paint work in the past was always so thick that much of the detail present on those would disappear anyway. So I'm really not looking for much.

But looking for existing images of such prints is very much not search engine friendly and I mostly just come up with Chinese soldier figures made out of some mystery material or figures of unknown scale.

Can anyone help me to find some reference pictures of 1:72 PLA figures so I can take a look if this level of detail is acceptable for me?

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[–] Linuto@lemmy.world 11 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (3 children)

Not answering your question exactly, but consider this:

Creality Ender 3 Pro (common entry level PLA printer) - $236

Elegoo Mars 3 Pro (common entry level resin printer) - $194.99

I own both for different reasons. As many will tell you, resin for minis, PLA for terrain.

Here is the best PLA mini I ever printed:

You simply cannot get the level of detail you would desire for mini painting from PLA. I know others out there have done better than I have in the above photo, but it still pales in comparison to an entry level resin printer.

Edit: I have a photo of the same model printed with resin, but having a hard time uploading it for some reason.

[–] cheeseisdisgusting@lemmy.sdf.org 2 points 9 months ago (3 children)

What nozzle and layer height were you printing with? I’ve printed a few minis with a 0.2mm nozzle and 0.08mm layer height and the results look much smoother than what you had…

[–] Apepollo11@lemmy.world 2 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago)

Exactly this. I still use a 0.4 nozzle and the results are more than satisfactory.

These figures were all support-free designs by EC3D, and are a joy to print.

At 0.08mm layers, you can feel the lines with a fingernail, but can't see the from more than a few cm away.

[–] sexybenfranklin@ttrpg.network 1 points 9 months ago (1 children)

Dude, that looks rough as hell compared to any resin print. I don't get why some people just have to cope so hard over this, resin is just better for detail, it's not a comment on your print skills or whatever.

[–] cheeseisdisgusting@lemmy.sdf.org 1 points 9 months ago

Oh, I agree, resin prints are much more detailed. I just wanted to provide another point of reference for FDM mini prints, since the parent commenter’s FDM prints looked… rough.

[–] Linuto@lemmy.world 1 points 9 months ago

This was probably 2 or 3 years ago, but I had a .2mm nozzle and .08 layer height as well most likely.

My pla prints have always looked rough, no matter what tutorials or tweaking I do.

[–] pixeltree@lemmy.world 1 points 9 months ago

Microcenter usually has a new customer deal that has an ender 3 pro or v2 for $100 btw

[–] Fogle@lemmy.ca 1 points 8 months ago (1 children)

Did you print him on his back with a 0.4 layer or what?

[–] Linuto@lemmy.world 1 points 8 months ago (1 children)

On his back, but 0.2mm

[–] Fogle@lemmy.ca 1 points 8 months ago (1 children)

Yeah print from bottom to top. That gives you the best resolution

[–] Linuto@lemmy.world 1 points 8 months ago (1 children)

That's what I typically do. This was an odd case where I had failed half a dozen prints already, and ended up getting a successful print with a different orientation.

[–] Fogle@lemmy.ca 1 points 8 months ago

Yeah fdm is not always the best or the easiest to get successful prints with. It takes a lot of supports and patience. Also try dropping layer height to .12

[–] ScoobyDoo27@lemm.ee 6 points 9 months ago (1 children)

1:72 of what? A 5’9” man?

You can get decent detail out of PLA filament printing but if you are talking really small the better option is to use a resin printer.

[–] Yora@diyrpg.org 3 points 9 months ago (2 children)

But resin printers also seem like they are 10 times as expensive. Which is why I am asking if anyone can help me to find out how detailed PLA actually gets at that scale.

[–] Linuto@lemmy.world 10 points 9 months ago (1 children)

This is a popular misconception, resin has become very affordable in recent years; see my other comment.

[–] Yora@diyrpg.org 9 points 9 months ago (3 children)

Then the unhelpful gatekeeper on Mastodon was not only extremely rude, but also talking complete nonsense.

Thanks.

[–] Anafroj@sh.itjust.works 7 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago)

I have both a resin printer and a FDM printer, I can confirm the price difference exists, but is not prohibitive (resin is about 2x PLA). The difference of quality is mind blowing, though (in favor of resin printer). If you're building an army, I assume you will have many pieces? If so, the difference of printing time is also mind blowing in favor of resin printer. The reason for that being that if you print 10x the same mini on your build surface, with FDM it will take 10x the same time as a single mini (the printing head must move to cover each point) while with the MSLA (resin printer), it will take… 1x the same time. That's because each layer is flashed from a PNG image, so all points of a layer are created at the same time. On top of that, there are things you can do with resin that you just can't with FDM, especially because of supports needed for hanging parts : if your character has arms, chances are the hand will be lower than the shoulder, which means than when printing from bottom to top, the hand won't be connected to the body until printing reaches the shoulder, so you need something to support it (a "tower" under the hand, that you will cut off). It's easy to do with resin, because in a bath of dense liquid, Archimedes is your friend and you can build the support in wild angles, but it's way more difficult in thin air (with a FDM).

An other thing to know, though, is that resin printing is way more messy. You will manipulate toxic products, that you can't throw in the sink, you need gear to cover your hands and face, and resin ends up everywhere and is near impossible to clean. But it's worth it, especially if you're into minis. :) FDM, on the other hand, is unbeatable for functional prints (because those resin prints are damn fragile, and tend to not be perfectly at the scale you designed).

[–] IMongoose@lemmy.world 7 points 9 months ago

The Internet do be like that.

My only suggestion is to look at health precautions with resin printing, I'm pretty sure ventilation is absolutely necessary and the liquids hazardous, but I too could be talking nonsense.

[–] Linuto@lemmy.world 2 points 9 months ago

You are welcome! I know there are many serious miniature painters who still don't find the quality of a 4k resin printer acceptable; I am not one of them. However, even pro miniature painters are content with 8k printers which can still be reasonably priced when on sale.

[–] ArbiterXero@lemmy.world 2 points 9 months ago

It doesn’t.

You could make a figure where you can see that it’s a man, but you’re getting no face. You’re getting no sword, no details at all

[–] bigredgiraffe@lemmy.world 5 points 9 months ago

For what it’s worth, I would bet finishing an FDM print with paint will be more annoying due to the layer lines before the scale would get in the way with a modern 3d printer as FDM does not produce a smooth surface finish like an injection molded part without further post processing like vapor smoothing which would also eat the details. I don’t have a resin printer though so I could be totally wrong.

[–] matejc@matejc.com 3 points 9 months ago (1 children)

I have made some figurines 4-5cm in height, with some random PLA, maybe it can serve as example for you... Btw, what do you mean by 1:72?

[–] Yora@diyrpg.org 2 points 9 months ago (2 children)

1 length unit on the model is 72 length units on the real object. Figures are about 2cm tall.

[–] matejc@matejc.com 2 points 9 months ago

Huh, 2cm in height.. I have twice as much height there and it was very difficult and time consuming to remove supports, also the figurines are very fragile, I can imagine that 2cm figurines would be even more difficult. If you have two nozzles on the printer you could use the second to print water soluble support material

[–] benignintervention@lemmy.world 1 points 9 months ago (1 children)

You're going to want to consider layer height. The layer height on FDM printers can be set usually between .12mm to .28mm. You need to look at your models and their actual sizes and see if any features will fall within that range. Depending on the print orientation, those will likely not resolve.

If you want higher resolution, you probably want a resin printer. They have more fidelity through screen resolution and the layer height can generally be between .025mm and .1mm. But they're more expensive and the resin is more expensive than just about any filament.

For 2cm model with a .2mm layer height, you're looking at like 20 layers with an FDM printer. With a resin printer and 0.5mm layer height, closer to 50 layers.

With a 2cm tall figure, in my opinion, you'll have issues getting the resolution you want on any printer. Expect to spend a lot of time troubleshooting and calibrating and troubleshooting and recalibrating.

I'll be happy to be proven wrong!

[–] Yora@diyrpg.org 1 points 9 months ago (2 children)

These are supposedly 1:72 resin figures. (No clue what printer, though.)

https://i.etsystatic.com/23671410/r/il/e17d8b/5222856934/il_1140xN.5222856934_b3ie.jpg

Look a bit rougher than injection mold, but for wargaming purposes this would be absolutely sufficient.

[–] benignintervention@lemmy.world 1 points 9 months ago

Yup, looks like resin to me. But I agree, they're good for wargaming

[–] HewlettHackard@lemmy.ca 1 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago) (1 children)

Those are resin prints, not FDM prints. The print technology (FDM vs resin) is the bigger factor than the actual plastic used (PLA vs others).

And that level of detail is impossible with FDM regardless of the plastic used.

[–] Yora@diyrpg.org 2 points 9 months ago

Yes, my post says that they are resin.

[–] Borimino@feddit.dk 2 points 9 months ago

The main problem i have had with printing minis has been getting the supports off of the print. FDM seemingly generates more support material than resin printing, and because the figure is as small as it is, it is quite difficult to get any tools in there to get the support material out.