this post was submitted on 05 Jul 2024

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Here's why proportional representation is important. (beehaw.org)

submitted 1 week ago by OofShoot@beehaw.org to c/politics@beehaw.org

27 comments fedilink hide all child comments

It doesn't matter if you're a Labor fan, the good times won't last. If you don't install proportional representation this will come back to bite you in the ass as it has before.

top 27 comments

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[–] Devi@beehaw.org 1 points 6 days ago

While I see the good bits of Proportional Representation, it does give extremism a foot in the door. Remember this is the voting pattern in a FPTP system, one of the tabloids even encouraged reform voters to switch to the Tories because of tactical voting. Changing the voting system gives these far right anti human rights parties a much better chance.

[–] pseudonym@monyet.cc 17 points 1 week ago (4 children)

Me in Canada: still bitter Trudeau abandoned this

[–] Trashboat@lemmy.blahaj.zone 8 points 1 week ago (2 children)

Me in the US: :(

[–] Kyatto@leminal.space 6 points 1 week ago

I'll cry with you trashboat, we're on the same.. trashy boat, as it were.

[–] TehPers@beehaw.org 3 points 1 week ago

Honestly the biggest issue in the US is the 2-party system, which means whoever has the most representation of the two basically runs the country uncontested.

[–] floofloof@lemmy.ca 6 points 1 week ago (1 children)

I seem to remember Labour in the UK promising proportional representation in the 1990s, only to win a landslide in 1997 and never mention it again.

[–] frazorth@feddit.uk 2 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago)

LibDems? We did vote for AV, and the 51% idiots voted against it.

AV for Commons, PR for the Lords replacement.

[–] Lionir@beehaw.org 3 points 1 week ago

What I find infuriating is that this same meme also happened at the provincial level in Quebec in 2018.

[–] Nonameuser678@aussie.zone 2 points 1 week ago

Me in Australia: finally something we're ahead of everyone on

[–] apotheotic@beehaw.org 17 points 1 week ago (3 children)

The saddest part of this is the tiny representation of the green party in parliament vs the voter sentiment :(

[–] frazorth@feddit.uk 10 points 1 week ago (1 children)

Ah, but these numbers come from this past election.

If we had PR then people would be more likely to vote Green because you don't have to be tactical. Your vote goes to a Green seat, rather than voting for another party to keep Tories out.

[–] blindsight@beehaw.org 3 points 1 week ago

Exactly this.

I'll never vote Green (as a Canadian) since it's strategically equivalent to not voting at all.

[–] deegeese@sopuli.xyz 9 points 1 week ago (1 children)

Don’t cast this as anti-Green. The right wing Reform party is twice as deprived.

Proportional representation is good for all fringe parties.

[–] apotheotic@beehaw.org 1 points 1 week ago

Your comment confuses me. I never said there was anything anti-Green, just that the saddest part (for me) is that the green party is under represented in parliament in our existing fptp system.

I fundamentally dislike reform and everything that they stand for, but it would be fair if they had proportional representation too.

[–] BirdyBoogleBop@lemmy.dbzer0.com 2 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (1 children)

Honestly if they weren't anti nuclear they might get more votes. It is definitely a wedge issue for a lot of people. They are also anti car which is good! Except I have never met anyone who is also anti car.

They also say weird things sometimes like wanting to reduce c sections and make birth a non medical event.

[–] apotheotic@beehaw.org 1 points 1 week ago

Honestly I'd take anti-nuclear over pro-fossil but yeah its not perfect.

I think part of the problem is that their entire MO is built around expecting to only get 1 or 2 seats.

I think they'd also get a lot more votes if people didn't need to vote tactically. A lot of the left wing voters would be freed up to vote with an actual left wing party

[–] knokelmaat@beehaw.org 11 points 1 week ago (1 children)

Could somebody explain this to me (I'm from Belgium, so we have proportional representation)? Is it similar to the USA with each state going to a single party?

[–] Rekhyt@beehaw.org 12 points 1 week ago (2 children)

Basically, yes. Each of the 650 constituencies votes in a single member of parliament, even if they don't get 50% of the vote, just more votes than anyone else. So if you have 3 constituencies that all vote 40% Labour, 35% Conservative, and 25% Lib Dem, you will get 3 Labour MPs, even though if it were proportional, you shpuld get at least 1 Conservative MP (sorry Lib Dems, too small a sample to let you have one too)

[–] knokelmaat@beehaw.org 4 points 1 week ago (1 children)

Thanks, this is very clear and also insane that it's still that way. I thought the US was the only place where popular vote differed from the actually elected officials!

[–] sqgl@beehaw.org 7 points 1 week ago

The only other European country which has FPTP voting is Belarus.

Canada has it too and Trudeau reneged on his promise to ditch it.

[–] lemmytellyousomething@lemmy.dbzer0.com 3 points 1 week ago (1 children)

What kind of dumpster fire voting system is that? They should be forced to fix it if tgey ever want to rejoin the EU.

[–] BirdyBoogleBop@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 points 1 week ago

We had a referendun on it in 2011 68% voted to keep FPTP instead of switching to Alternative Vote.

[–] Blackmist@feddit.uk 7 points 1 week ago (1 children)

The issue with any two party system is that they'll both fight tooth and nail to keep it that way.

The PR referendum was the only time they've ever worked together and the public fell for it.

[–] GiddyGap@lemm.ee 5 points 1 week ago

The issue with any two party system is that they'll both fight tooth and nail to keep it that way.

American here. Can confirm.

[–] Lionir@beehaw.org 5 points 1 week ago

I mean, even if you're a labour fan, I can't imagine needing to do a coalition with the liberal democrats and greens would hurt. That said, I don't know much about UK politics.

[–] milicent_bystandr@lemm.ee 4 points 1 week ago (1 children)

My complaint is more about how voting has becoming about voting in a party that most aligns with how you want the country run, rather than voting for a wise and trusted member of your community (constituency) to be part of parliament.

But that's a bigger question of demographics and societal change, not just politics, and perhaps it's not my place to ill-judge societal change.

[–] noxfriend@beehaw.org 4 points 1 week ago

It seems to be human nature to group together like that. It makes sense from a game theory perspective, too. Perhaps political parties are inevitable