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I thought they were all about state's rights vs federal mandate. If it doesn't happen in their state, they can fuck off.
States' Rights is a euphemism for the reactionary cause du jour. You can call them out for a contradiction, but at best they will just ignore you because they know and we know they're not talking about or concerned with the rights of states vs. federal mandate. Then there's always the threat that they will drop the euphemism and say that they want to punish promiscuous women and trans deviants. Trump has largely proven that the right doesn't have to watch its mouth near as much as they used to think. Rather than abandon their political identity, the majority of the "moderate" right will go along with the new framing. The only ones who lose out in this shift in rhetoric are women and trans people, who are now directly and publicly targeted not just by the reactionary fringes but by the right as a whole.
If you're wondering, yes, I absolutely lifted most of this from the Alt-Right Playbook, "The Death of a Euphemism"
It is impossible for a conservative to enter any conversation in good faith. Honesty is simply not a conservative trait. Every word uttered by a conservative is either deception or manipulation. Every word.
I get where you're coming from and why, I really do, but I think saying stuff like that is really unhelpful.
I'm about as left wing as they come, but I grew up in rural Florida. All the bullshit you see about the place? That's my family. None of them specifically have shown up on the news, but still, it's them - their beliefs, attitudes, etc.
The issue isn't deception or manipulation from regular conservatives. When my grandparents / cousins spit out that sort of bullshit, that's not what's going on.
The issue, rather, is a complex one that is, among other things, a thing of trust.
They believe, honestly and truly, in Fox News. They believe in their preachers. They believe that homosexuality is a demon that possesses people, and by interacting with "the gays," you "open the door" to demonic influence in your life.
That last bit is an example of something I was outright taught.
When my grandparents talk about how it'd be good for America to round up all the gays and put them in concentration camps, what they're feeling is protectiveness. They want to protect people from Satan's influence, and if someone has accepted the enemy to the point of being proudly gay, then why should people be sympathetic to them? Get rid of them all, obviously.
Yes, it's insane and hurtful and stupid and so frustrating that I haven't spoken to my extended family in a few years.
But they're not trying to trick people. They don't need to think about what they believed before, they don't need to second guess what's right, they know what's right. What's right is believing in the authority figures they've been trained to believe in. What is right is to listen, to obey, to fight as they are directed to fight, for the good of all.
It's horrifying from the outside, but from the inside, it's a safe little bubble where you don't have to wonder and worry about what is the right thing to do. It's easy - the only hard part is acting on it. Do what's right, and everything else will fall into place. It's simple and feels good.
To challenge that way of thinking, to suggest that they have to figure it out themselves - that's a huge ask. Going against what they've been taught their whole lives, and for what? To have to deal with moral uncertainty and unsolvable moral dilemmas? That's hardly a reason to change.
Good comment. Upvoted.
Im going to use this comment to explain this idea to people. Im a lefty too and I grew up almost just like you. Whenever I try to explain this , it always comes out like I'm an apologist for all the crappy stuff they do and it makes people think I'm a closeted conservative. I have never once seen this explained so perfectly and succinctly. Thanks for sharing, really
Thank you very much!
Yeah, I've run into that plenty myself. Hell, I'm a woman and I have a wife, and I was once accused of being homophobic... as I was trying to explain why I was happy about living thousands of kilometers from my family.
It really bugs me when people accuse people like my grandparents of being "hateful." If my grandparents see that, they'll just see more "proof" that left wingers have no idea what they're talking about.
I can't do anything to fix the issues on the conservative side of the fence - I really wish I could - but I can hopefully help on my side of the fence, with fostering better understanding and communication.
My break from conservative thinking was... uh... perhaps best described as a violent psychological event. I went from thinking we were the good guys, to maybe getting some things wrong, to suddenly realizing I'd been unknowingly on the side of evil my whole life. Meeting someone who was gay and hearing his story, about the abuse he took from people who acted exactly as I'd been taught to... Stars above, that ripped out my heart.
And if I hadn't already had my beliefs cracking and under pressure, I'd have blown off his story as pure manipulation.
It's a whole thing, for me. I can only hope for reconciliation of some kind. My family members aren't really evil people - they mean well, even if they only consider people who are straight, white, and Christian to be fully people.
But calling them things they aren't won't ever get them to listen.
Not that I know what would get them to listen, beyond convincing their pastor of things...
State’s rights has always been disingenuous. Back when the Southern states were using it as a shield to own literal slaves, they took a break from their precious state’s rights long enough to demand other states send their escaped slaves back to them, before harping on state’s rights again.
It’s as disingenuous as the person harping on free speech while they say something obnoxious, but suddenly want to limit your speech when you call them out on it.
The South has never used “state’s rights” in good faith, it’s always been an excuse to be bigots.
Same with their views on small government id assume.
Are we gonna have to have a fucking underground railroad situation for abortion in this country? Some days I wish the sun would just implode.
I'm sad to say that we've already been having to have another fucking underground railroad situation, for both pregnant and trans people. =/
I’d say the beginnings are already here. There are already organization helping people travel for medical care where they live in a state ideologically opposed. I’ve considered donating to a few
I'm lending my spare room to a friend who's fleeing Texas, but I feel like I should do more..
As a gay Texan, you are doing plenty! Helping anyone helps everyone.
Gotta start building it now while it's not banned federally. Will make things easier if it does happen
Probably not.
This is just posturing for their constituency.
We need a compromise, we need to separate into free states and hate states.
Wait, we’ve got that. Okay, we need to create laws that… okay never mind. Let me check my notes.
…apparently we need a crazy eyed straight man to lead an armed trans rebellion, and to bring DC in as a free state.
While I'm sure there are a lot of conservatives in Maine, I don't think they appreciate being threatened by Florida, no matter what the reason.