this post was submitted on 11 Aug 2023
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I'm American, and I believe both sides raise valid points and both sides have problems. The polarization on both sides and refusal to listen to the other side is what is destroying this country politically.
The last presidential race, we got an egotistical maniac and a guy who is too senile to know where he is or how to form a sentence. This is the best we can do?
I am NOT saying both sides are the same.
I'm not American and I think both sides of the American political divide are bonkers
But I can't talk as all we are doing in the UK is following you down the same mad rabbit hole
I’m amazed at how incredibly bad labour is at getting its shit together. Come on people!
But you are when you make statements like that. You're downplaying the much much worse one when you use any sort of language that can be interpreted as "both bad." Biden is not senile. He's not everyone's cup of tea, fine. But he's not attempting a coup or attempting to dismantle democracy when he doesn't get his way. It's absurd to even speak of both in the same sentence.
Meets the terms of the post, so good job.
My main beef with Democrats is that they don't give two shits about codifying the stuff that was "legalized" by SCOTUS decisions, or marijuana. They use it as fodder for their re-election campaigns then do nothing to fix any of it. Womens' rights and LGBT rights are human rights, but Dems keep using them as pawns to point at the Republicans and blame them, then do nothing for four years except raise taxes. I'm getting tired of it.
And about Biden, keep in mind he didn't want his kids growing up in a racial jungle. We need to do better than this.
I assume you know why Republicans are bad.
They may have had a chance to push it, but they didn't have the votes to pass it. Something that's overstated is how much control of congress the Democrats have had, specially in the Obama Administration. It's been said that they had 2 years, but they only had a few weeks between Senators being hospitalized, AL Fraken being seated and Ted Kennedy's replacement being seated. Something similar happened early this year with Feinstein (That's another topic all together) being hospitalized. Second, during the Obama admin they didn't have a party-platform mandate. Lieberman almost ran with McCain in 2008, he was only somewhat aligned with Democrats and is largely the reason we didn't get a public option. I'd like to see things move further left, but as you can see the current makeup of Congress doesn't allow it.
That was 50 years ago, and not at all uncommon of a feeling during the time. It's a product of his time, just look at how much worse it was across the isle. I don't think it should be held against an 80 year old when they have largely left those feelings in the past. None of us can know what thing future generations will judge us about in 50 years. Now someone of that age range that continued to feel that way you can judge. Personally I think it's wrong to continue to judge someone for their past actions once they correct it. You should incentivize people to change. If you endlessly criticize them it'll just make them stay the course and only associate with like minded people.
"If you don't vote for me, you ain't black!"
He made a dumb joke, but here's the full context
Yeah and that's a weird thing to say, doesn't make it any better
It's playful banter. The interviewer starts it with "you can't do that to Black Media" jokingly when he needs to leave, and his response is pointing out the obvious. The kind of Black people consuming Black Media aren't going to be voting for Trump, so it'll be ok that he has to leave. Biden isn't a great public speaker. He didn't word this one well. It wasn't a prepared statement, it was a response to other playfuyl banter. It's primarily been used against him by right wing media in false outrage.
I can't be bothered to care about playful banter. He's not redirecting government resources or ignoring folks that didn't vote for him like the last administration. The context above makes it clear what he meant too.
Doesn't matter whether it was a joke or not, and it doesn't matter if he's a product of his time or not. If any Republican made jokes like that, progressives would be out with the pitchforks, but because he has a D after his name, Biden gets a pass. It's ridiculous.
No, the person's intent matters entirely. It's the same issue with comedians making jokes. Some get a pass and some don't. It's all about knowing the person's actual feelings, intent, and historical actions. Dave Chapelle and Kevin Hart received significant pushback from their statements on Trans and Gay people respectively because neither had shown to support either group prior to saying them. Hart, to his credit, has eventually learned why his statements were hurtful and has corrected his behavior (Side note the docuseries on Netflix? i think is pretty great. It covers part of this where he is extremely bullheaded about needing to apologize and how going on Ellen should have been enough, and members of his staff do show him why he's wrong. Overall the series is sort of tragic as his motives are at odds with his family and I came away feeling sad for him more than anything).
If Biden is racist, he's not showing it in any meaningful way today. Republicans don't get the benefit of doubt because their policies are already anti-black. You may want to judge everything separately, but that's not how it works. If someone does or says 9 racists things, it's safe to assume the 10th thing is racist too.
"the first mainstream African-American who is articulate and bright and clean." -- Biden, referring to President Obama
"Poor kids are just as smart and talented as white kids!"
"It's awful hard, as well, to get Latinx vaccinated as well. Why? They're worried that they will be vaccinated and deported."
"Unlike the African American community, with notable exceptions, the Latino community is an incredibly diverse community with incredibly different attitudes about different things."
"That’s like saying you . . . before you got in this program, you’re take [sic] a test whether you’re taking cocaine or not. What do you think? Huh? Are you a junkie?" -- Biden asking a Black reporter if he's a cocaine junkie after the reporter asked if he had taken a cognitive test
"You cannot go to a 7-Eleven or a Dunkin’ Donuts unless you have a slight Indian accent."
These are all from this century. Don't tell me he isn't racist. Even Harris said that she was personally affected by his racist policies growing up. He also has a long history of working with and praising segregationists. The guy is a fraud who's senile.
I'm not saying that the Republicans are any better. Far from it. I'm saying that Biden gets away with it because he gets a D after his name.
I’m not going to reply to cherry picked quotes with no context. I’ve already said he’s not a great speaker, he’s 80 years old, and he’s changed from the past. His policies now are what I care about. Saying dumb things off the cuff isn’t the same as doing things actively to hurt blacks or minorities. If he was saying those things and actively harming those people he would be criticized all the same. Context matters.
He has a long history of supporting segregationist policies because he didn't want his kids growing up in a racial jungle. Those are HIS WORDS. If you're going to ignore all of this and fail to realize that the Democrats need to do better, then you're just proving my point.
You picked Team Blue, so in your mind, they are always right, and Team Red is always wrong. This binary view of politics is what is destroying this country.
It shouldn’t surprise me that you’re making binary judgement calls on me when you’re doing it to Biden. I never said Democrats don’t need to get better. I never said Biden was my first choice, that I support a majority of his ideas, or anything like that. I simply reject attacking him for things in the past that he’s corrected in the present when the alternative is active harm.
Further, I didn’t choose team blue. Team red stopped being an option for me, so my upbringing of red-leaning purple turned blue by default. My primary concern is not letting anti-democratic fascists gain power. I can’t be bothered not picking off the cuff comments made in the past (his kids are in their 50s for fucks sake).
So he can say whatever stupid racist crap he wants because he's old and ran against Trump. Got it.
I’ve been quite clear. You’re either acting in bad faith or are incapable of nuanced discussion. Either way, I’m leaving it here.
Funny you would say that considering that you're willing to ignore Biden's faults because of Trump. We need to do better than this. In 2020, we had two racist pieces of shit who like to feel up women and girls running against each other. It blows my mind that anyone on the left could actually support Biden and dismiss his remarks because he's old and ran against Trump.
Trump is finally getting nailed, but Biden can get away with sniffing young girls' hair and touching on national TV? No wonder this country is in trouble.
Biden isn't the democratic party. Trump isn't the republican. I'm talking about the party. They are individuals. I'm talking about policies. There are good and bad policies in every party, and because you get demonized for not subscribing to it all you can't pick and choose. But yes, I know it's not the popular opinion, which is extremely scary to me.
Both sides ARE bad. The real issue is that both sides have latched onto some valid points and you need to eat their whole philosophy or the rest of the base will consider you a monster. Then they come out of the woodwork and say crap like "you're saying both sides are the same" to justify shutting on people who don't subscribe to the dogma. If you want to say that one side has latched onto a specific type of person sure. But that doesn't mean you have to subscribe to the opposite side and forgo your own mind and sense of political advocacy. Things are going as they are because they are being propped up by people desperate to justify their past decisions instead of learning from them.
Well, USA is an oligarchy... Perhaps I'll add this as a comment!
Yes it is!
I can't believe people refer to Biden as senile and not Trump. Go google Trump nuclear speech and tell me that man isn't senile, he can't even form 3 coherent sentences in a row.
I never said Trump wasn't senile. They both need to retire.