Ask Lemmy

Hah, don't try to play the reasonable middle-ground card with me.

Are you saying what I'm saying is a reasonable middle ground? Cos the rest of your response looks like ur calling my beliefs non reasonable and not a middle ground.

Sure, hide behind semantics. I'm clearly talking about conservatism as an ideology - the same ideology that opposes progress and protects hierarchies of power worldwide. Whether it's the US Republican party, the UK Tories, or Australia's Liberal party - it's all built on the same foundations of preserving privilege for some at the expense of others.

Do you truly believe half the population has absolutely zero good points?

Bull. The policies your "side" keeps pushing TARGET specific groups of people - immigrants, LGBTQ+ folks, Black and brown communities. Don't pretend it's about some noble principle when the outcomes keep hurting the same people over and over.

Again its not my side. I choose to believe in some of their beliefs. I've lost more liberties under left wing governments than I have under right wing governments.

Are you seriously comparing leftist policies to Nazism? This is peak bad-faith argument. Hitler used promises of "equality" as a very thin veneer to scapegoat Jews and other minorities. Hitler's "equality" was only (and openly) for his defined "master race" - it was exclusionary by design. Leftist policies aim to include everyone in their benefits. In some cases the same tactics the right uses today, Hitler was far closer to today's right-wingers than left

I am comparing the stated goals of Hitler to the stated goals of the left. Specific y in the context of tankies who are also supporting genocidal regimes. The lefts equality excludes me, I get paid less for the exact same job, and I get less scholarship opportunities simply because I'm a straight white man. Equality of outcome is actively fucking over my equality of opportunity.

No, we don't. Being intolerant of intolerance isn't the same as hating someone for their identity. Calling out bigotry isn't "hate" - it's accountability.

Because that's all the left ever does huh? U seriously believe this? What are the tankies doing? Are they haring or just calling out bigotry?

I refuse to accept this false equivalence.

There u go proving my original point that your too ideologically captured to even consider the other side.

This talking point is so tired. There IS no "equality of opportunity" when systemic barriers exist from birth. Your side loves to pretend we're all starting on equal footing when that's demonstrably false.

I not claiming we have equality of opportunity I'm just saying that is what we should be aiming for.

Oh, so you enjoy the benefits of "leftist" policies while arguing against them? How convenient. And yes, your healthcare system IS better than our nightmare - because it operates on COLLECTIVE responsibility rather than individual "freedom."

I do. I like a lot of leftist policies. I'm just arguing for you to consider that not all leftist policies are good and not all conservative policies are bad.

They're not all the same, and that was my entire point about. What they lie ABOUT matters.

So u know ur being lied to, being sold a false dream and yet u are defending one lie because u think its a better lie than the other lie.

When progressive leaders lie, they're promising universal healthcare, living wages, and equal rights they might not be able to deliver.

By equal rights do u mean no rights?

When conservative leaders lie, they're just literally scapegoating immigrants, LGBTQ+ people, and minorities for all of society's problems.

I think ur missing quite a bit on nuance here. But yes that's essentially what they are doing.

I align with the side that at least has to PRETEND to care about making everyone's lives better, not the side that openly campaigns on making certain people's lives worse. The fact that you can't see this difference proves you're not the "free thinker" you claim to be.

It doesn't make my life better. It makes my taxes worse, it gives other people more opportunities that I don't have, it makes my vote less valuable, it erodes my liberties. Its the same its just that the left is scapegoating a different group. The fact u can't see this proves that your are completely ideologically captured.

Both sides have corruption and liars, but only one side has to appeal to basic human decency to get votes. That's why it matters who supports whom, even knowing politicians will more likely than not disappoint me.

Basic human decency huh? Do you think you are the righteous justified in any action as the ends justify any means? As I said before that's what Hitlers followers believed.

Yet here you are, repeating every conservative talking point in the book. You claim to be above it all while pushing the exact rhetoric that maintains the status quo.

I believe I also pushed for free healthcare and bodily autonomy (the right to an abortion etc) I didn't realise those where right wing talking points.

Save your "both sides" nonsense for someone who'll fall for it. I'm not interested.

Again proving my original point that you cannot fathom the idea that the other side might have some good points. You are the one who is ideologically captured incapable of individual free thinking.