this post was submitted on 12 Mar 2025
875 points (95.4% liked)
Memes
48267 readers
2959 users here now
Rules:
- Be civil and nice.
- Try not to excessively repost, as a rule of thumb, wait at least 2 months to do it if you have to.
founded 5 years ago
MODERATORS
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
view the rest of the comments
Support more progressive democrats like AOC and Bernie
That won't fix things, though. The Democratic party can't go against its base, the bourgeoisie, it acts like a great filter. An actual worker party, like PSL, needs to be built up and supported instead.
Bernie has literally stated that he only runs as a Dem because of the 2 party system and would otherwise be an independent which is the case with most progressives.
Turning up your nose at 2 perfectly good candidates in favor of some non-existent hypothetical candidate is crazy.
it's not crazy; it's ackowledging the absurdity that there's no real choice and examples like mexico w shienbaum & amlo proved that it's easily possible once you stop uncritically swallowing this type of propaganda.
Correct, Bernie's strategy also hasn't worked. As a Communist I don't consider Bernie and AOC to be "perfectly good," and the 2 party system itself needs to be overthrown in order to be fixed, which isn't happening at the ballot box either.
Bernie and those like him have informed me and many others of what a good politician can look like and may have inspired others like AOC to start their career. I will support them as much as I can because they may inspire even more like them to actually have enough people to make a meaningful change in the party or, if we miraculously get away from the two party system, spin up a new one.
Bernie certainly isn't as bad as, say, Fetterman, but he has his fair share of bad policy (especially foreign policy, which ends up just being justification for US Imperialism), and due to how the 2 party system works the Democrats will never be able to truly be "taken over" by progressives, as that would hurt their donor-base, the bourgeoisie. A genuine worker party is necessary, but it will not be capable of being reformist, it must be revolutionary, ie PSL.
I respectfully disagree that the party could never change due to their current funding, and I am rubbed the wrong way by how you continue to seem to push that I shouldn't support better politicians just because they aren't perfect.
If what you are saying is that the democratic party could change because we vote in enough progressives then I have a bridge to sell you. The capitalists who own the government would just out-finance progressive election attempts. Think of how many progressives we would need to have it impact the whole Dem party, now think about how many elections that is where the entire force of the media is against the politician who will actually fight for you. Now consider how easily manipulated our wildly uneducated population is.
I know its a bitter pill to swallow but capitalism has already destroyed democracy long ago. It is just that we have been in decline for so long now that it is finally becoming unavoidably obvious.
Not trying to be mean, but how do you envision the DNC changing its tune?
As for your bit on me implying only perfection is acceptable, that's not my stance, rather what I consider acceptable is pretty different. Again, I'm a Communist, that doesn't mean I need my candidate to start a guerilla war from the mountains against their local Wal-Mart, but it does mean I hold stock in anti-US Imperialism and a dedication to bringing about Socialism, which at this point does require revolution.
Unfortunately I dont have the time or willpower to go into detail and I do disagree with how you want change to come about, but if what you want happens, I truly hope it results in a better society for people to live in. I think we can both agree we just want things to be better for people.
Sure, that's fair enough. I think a big problem with communication on Lemmy is people speaking past each other.
On a side note, if you do decide you want to talk, I can do so, or if you want recommendations on Marxist-Leninist theory I can provide some good works if you want to understand my viewpoint better.
Bernie, the guy who refuses to call the Palestinian genocide a genocide? This marvelous tweet Bernie? https://lemmy.ml/pictrs/image/d200e7bc-08c9-4b63-954b-0a7973050cc3.jpeg Bernie the supporter of about every US regime war?
Oh look, pathetic personal attacks and baseless slander when they have no arguments to counter facts.
The best you can expect from an ignorant lemm.ee bot with a one day old account. LOL
Try not to call other users bots, even if you are provoked by them.
OK, as long as their comments are removed or they get banned.
But usually I get that treatment when I reply.
They usually do, here. If someone breaks the rules, report them, don't feed them. If you want an instance with little interaction with liberals, Hexbear.net or Lemmygrad.ml might be a better fit too. I personally keep both a Lemmy.ml and a Hexbear.net account.
You are in .ml, of course they would advocate for someone further left than Bernie and AOC no matter how implausible their ideas are.
To be clear, AOC's and Bernie's ideas don't seem to have a real path to implementation. Marxists aren't idealists, we are practical and are Materialists, and part of that practicality is understanding that policies can sound good, but without a path to implementation they might as well be ghosts, even if they are more moderate ideas.
Funny how their "marxist" ideas are and have been implemented in Europe for 80+ years.
I didn't call Bernie or AOC Marxists, rather they are Social Democrats. I myself am a Marxist-Leninist and am speaking as one, hence "we." Social Democracies in the Nordics are built on Imperialism, that's how they sustain themselves, and only have the privledges they do because the bourgeoisie was afraid of revolution like in Russia when it first went Socialist.