this post was submitted on 13 Jun 2024
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No Stupid Questions

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apparently my city literally literally banned public rail funding, and people online love jerking off about how good biking is, so i figured might as well try. I have come up with:

pros:

  • good for mental health / exercise / endorphins
  • arguably quaint
  • feel like an old timey guy taking his wares to market
  • feel european
  • can annoy others
  • less of a police state around them vs cars
  • more flexible parking, routes
  • capacity to be peaceful
  • nice in summer

cons:

  • look like an annoying dork (esp w neon - which also hurts the quaint factor)
  • have to wear a helmet (^)
  • getting sweaty, potentially "unpresentable" for work
  • still have to find safe parking
  • still takes a while
  • have to find new routes to places
  • can't listen to music or might die
  • little meaningful protection against severe injury
  • can only carry so many groceries/etc
  • sucks in winter
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[–] MonkRome@lemmy.world -2 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago) (3 children)

A helmet is only needed if you intend to spend significant time in traffic. Most of the world doesn't use one.

The math behind using one is a lot more on the margins than people realize. In order for it to save you, it first has to prevent a head injury, and then prevent one that is in the range of severity that makes it useful. The vast majority of bike injuries won't fall in that range, they'll either be related to another part of the body, or in the case of high speed crashes from a car, too severe for a helmet to matter. But helmets do give people a false sense of security. Statistically people ride faster and take more risks with a helmet on. Lastly, again statistically, the visibility gear you put on yourself while riding does more to keep you safe in traffic than a helmet. Lights, reflectors, reflective vest, etc.

All this to say, the religiosity with which people proselytize helmets is misplaced. I still wear one, but I don't judge people who choose not to.

[–] commandar@lemmy.world 6 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago) (1 children)

A helmet is only needed if you intend to spend significant time in traffic.

The worst wreck I've ever had on a bike was without a single car in sight. Pinch flat while carrying speed through a steep downhill curve. I split an expensive MIPS helmet in two and still hit hard enough that I had a minor concussion, road rash up one side of my body, and cracked the face of a week old watch just to pour salt in the (metaphorical) wound. I mostly landed on my head and that helmet is the reason I didn't have drastically more severe head injuries.

Helmets aren't just for traffic.

[–] MonkRome@lemmy.world 4 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago) (2 children)

I don't doubt anything you are saying, but it's worth mentioning that (iirc) 80%+ of severe injury and death on a bicycle is caused by motor vehicles, or complications of motor vehicle involvement. People very rarely have severe injury or death on dedicated bike infrastructure. The primary risk on bicycles is motor vehicles. If you remove motor vehicles, there is still risks, but someone might decide that risk is low enough to forgo a helmet. I don't feel those people should be called stupid for their choice.

There is considerable evidence that everyone wearing a helmet in a car would save vastly more lives and prevent severe head injury, and yet pretty much no one even considers that as a normal thing to do. The bike helmet thing is therefore just as much a cultural attitude, as it is about safety.

I still use a helmet, and more importantly, visibility gear, on my bicycle in 100% of my rides. I've never worn a bike helmet walking or driving in a car, even though my cousin died from a head injury getting hit by a car while walking and my grandma-in-law died of a head injury in a car...

[–] AchtungDrempels@lemmy.world 5 points 4 months ago

There is also this interesting dutch study, where somehow helmeted cyclists were 25 times more likely to end up in a hospital. Of course the reason for that never comes up as something problematic from the side of our solely safety concerned citizens, they will congratulate you for your new speed record down that hill.

[–] commandar@lemmy.world 2 points 4 months ago

80%+ of severe injury and death on a bicycle is caused by motor vehicles, or complications of motor vehicle involvement.

Which would mean ~1 in 5 have absolutely nothing to do with a motor vehicle. That's significant.

There is considerable evidence that everyone wearing a helmet in a car would save vastly more lives and prevent severe head injury

Then that should be an easy [citation needed] for you because my searches are coming up blank for actual studies. Lots of assertions of it, but I'm not finding anything in terms of actual data.

It's very easy, on the other hand, to find comprehensive meta analyses on the efficacy of helmet use.

It's also worth noting that the introduction makes a point of calling out another common online assertion that you repeated -- that helmets make people engage in more risk-taking behavior -- as false:

There has already been an extensive peer-reviewed literature review conducted by Esmaeilikia et al.5, which found little to no support for increased risk-taking when cyclists use helmets and if anything, they cycled with more caution.

I don’t feel those people should be called stupid for their choice.

I don't think they're stupid. I think they're bad at risk analysis. That's a pretty inherent feature of humans. It's the reason I want to see actual data.

[–] imaqtpie@lemmy.myserv.one 1 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago)

You make some good points.

I still wear one, but I don’t judge people who choose not to.

I don't wear one and I judge myself for not doing so 🤷

Complicated issue.

[–] AchtungDrempels@lemmy.world 1 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago) (1 children)

the religiosity with which people proselytize helmets is misplaced.

It feels very much religion like, but also an online phenomenon only. IRL the helmet discussion goes like this for me: "You don't wear a helmet?" "No."

The topic coming up is super rare too, while on every picture of a cyclist without a helmet on the internet you got all these comments from helmet fundamentalists going nuts over it.

[–] Nighed@feddit.uk 13 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago) (1 children)

Personally, I have cracked open a helmet once. On a quiet country lane, with no traffic. Pot holes can catch you any time.

I don't remember the crash, just the slide.

That is what makes me tell people to wear helmets.

[–] AchtungDrempels@lemmy.world -2 points 4 months ago (1 children)

And your friends don't get annoyed?

I hope you also posted one of those wonderful "today the helmet saved my life" topics on reddit so the community could get together for their daily service.

[–] Nighed@feddit.uk 4 points 4 months ago (1 children)

My cycling club mandates helmets, so not a problem. Only really come up with the hire bikes in cities etc.

Nope, I was to busy being miserable about having a broken collar bone.

[–] AchtungDrempels@lemmy.world 2 points 4 months ago (1 children)

Broken collar bone, the classic.

Sorry if i came off rude, i am just so over people claiming that every kind of cycling is dangerous and all that can save you is a helmet.

I mentioned in another comment that there is a dutch study that finds the helmeted rider to be more than 25 times more likely to end up in a hospital. 25 times more likely. Obviously roadies and MTBers. I am absolutely not saying people should stop road or mountain biking, even that is not all that dangerous and practitioners don't all end up dead or crippled sooner or later.

But if a person is just casually cycling without a helmet, they are doing much more for their safety than those sporty riders with helmets. Somehow this then always gets countered with "i know someone who fell on his head while stationary and is now being spoonfed by his loved ones. No, he didn't have clips / clipless pedals". Made up bullshit in 99.9% of cases, i have seen this in almost every helmet topic i have read.

[–] Nighed@feddit.uk 3 points 4 months ago

It's all about risk tolerance. It was thought that improved brakes on cars would hugely improve safety. However it had a much smaller affect as people just braked later... There is a level of acceptable risk that everyone has, increasing safety measures just means they take more risks up to that level.

Helmets make people feel safer so they do more risky things and therefore hurt themselves more in other ways.

Doesn't mean you shouldn't wear one though!