Yeah, you can only sort-of make that argument about the last couple of centuries, and you have to say that all the genocides were worth it for vaccines and a steady food supply to do so.

I'm not convinced civilisation could collapse entirely do to climate change, though. Break into small warring pieces maybe, but as long as there's still arable land somewhere people aren't just giving up. And even in the crazy 10C scenarios Antarctica stays on the cool side of temperate.

[–] Cybersteel@lemmy.ml 1 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Modern infrastructure will collapse in very extreme climates. Even if humanity survives tribally, there is no way for civilization to develop. Easy access to all those sweet sweet oil is long gone. Alternate forms of energy won't be possible for future tribal man without the steppingstone that is oil.

[–] CanadaPlus@lemmy.sdf.org 1 points 1 year ago

Modern infrastructure will collapse in very extreme climates.

I mean, the existing infrastructure will be stressed, sure. But it's not like it hits 60C and all the roads and bridges instantly crumble. The question is if you can afford to fix your infrastructure when it does degrade, or if it becomes a losing battle. We forget but we're so far above subsistence at this point; for most of human history almost everyone worked at producing food, and now it's maybe 2% in the West. I think it's very likely that we'll keep something resembling civilisation going, if maybe a poorer version.

The bigger concern is if we decide to nuke ourselves fighting over who gets a slightly larger slice of the shrinking pie.

Alternate forms of energy won’t be possible for future tribal man without the steppingstone that is oil.

Nah. Steam engines can run on biomass too, and hydro/wind is just magnets and mechanical parts. Once you have enough industry to make your first solar panels, it's off to the races. I've spent an unreasonable amount of time researching exactly this. Fossil fuel makes it all a lot cheaper and easier to scale but you can do without from an engineering perspective.

[–] emeralddawn45@discuss.tchncs.de 1 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Oh good, the evil narcissists with the armies of bootlickers will be able to survive by enslaving their followers and using their wealth to retreat to bunkers or uninhabited land masses. That sure bodes well for the future of humanity.

[–] CanadaPlus@lemmy.sdf.org 1 points 1 year ago

Same as it's always been, right? I hold onto hope that the enlightenment will stick, but I can't guarantee it.

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