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It takes like 10 minutes of googling to see Zionism is an umbrella term for multiple different schools of thoughts. People are turning it into some slur when at its core it’s the belief that Jews have a right to a state. Keep in mind that Jews are both a race and a religion.
Race is a construct. We are all the same species.
Yes but so is Money, the significance of a social construct comes from how much society as a whole puts stock in the ideas. Unfortunately race is very relevant in today's world as ethnicity and perceived race is a big factor in how issues are discussed and acted on.
I may be overreacting a bit, but your comment sounds a lot like the colorblind/all lives matter rethoric to me in this context, so I want to emphasize it's significance to this discussion.
Well it's more of a state in a specific place and that maybe everyone should go there.
Several different locations were considered at first. I think the levant was chosen because it renders the “go back where you came from” argument moot since they’d be living in the area they originated from.
Bullcrap. Zionism originated as an antisemitic Christian idea that was specifically based on the premise that Jewish people "don't belong" in (so-called) "western civilization" and should return "where they came from" - ie, Palestine.
White supremacist much? Do you want to tell me now that Ethiopian Jewish people and Ashkenazi are the same "race"?
Uh no, Zionism is not a Christian idea. It’s been an idea long before Christianity was even around. I’m flabbergasted that you called me a white supremacist for stating a fact. Ethiopian and Ashkenazi Jews could very well share DNA linking them back to the original Jewish diaspora.
https://geneticliteracyproject.org/2017/03/21/beta-israel-reconsidered-defending-israelite-ancestry-ethiopian-jews/
“As the BBC reports, the study suggests that “Ethiopians mixed with Egyptian, Israeli or Syrian populations about 3,000 years ago.” Professor Chris Tyler-Smith, from the Wellcome Trust Sanger Institute, told the BBC: “By analyzing the genetics of Ethiopia and several other regions we can see that there was gene flow into Ethiopia, probably from the Levant, around 3,000 years ago, and this fits perfectly with the story of the Queen of Sheba.” Note that the study does not contradict the 2007 work by Entine or other historical evidence. The results suggest that Israelites-Jews entered the region 3,000 years ago, but they were not necessarily consolidated as a group until about 1,500 years ago. Also, note the study does not necessarily confirm the biblical story of affair between Queen Sheba of ancient Ethiopia and king Solomon of ancient Israel.”
Here’s another
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3543766/
“By principal component analysis, it was observed that the Jewish populations of Europe, North Africa, and the Middle East formed a tight cluster that distinguished them from their non-Jewish neighbors (Fig. 1). Within this central cluster, each of these Jewish populations formed its own subcluster, in addition to the more remote localization of members of some Diaspora communities. The observation of a major central tight cluster was supported by statistical metrics for genetic distances (Fst, allelic sharing distances).”
With all this said, even if Ethiopian Jews and Ashkenazi Jews are not actually genetically related, they still get targeted the same whether they practice Judaism or not.
Oh, look... a white supremacist is "flabbergasted" that someone pointed out their white supremacism.
Yawn.
Nope. Christian zionism predates Jewish zionism by about two decades. It's such non-controversial history you'll even find it on wikipedia, Clyde.
I'm genetically related to every other human being on the planet, genius - does that make me every "race" according to people like you who buy into the tenets of "race science"?
I have literally no idea how Jewish communities sharing specific DNA linking them to the levant has anything to do with white supremacy, or how that makes me a white supremacist. Zionism started after the Jewish Diaspora in 8th century BCE. Are all scientists that study genetics racist? Where are you getting this from and why are you so angry about it?
No, it didn’t. Zionism started in the late 1800s/early 1900s.
This has happened before. One specific movement started then, but the idea is very old https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Return_to_Zion
And that’s not “Zionism.” You could say it was a precursor, but Zionism is distinct thing.
This is the very first line in the book “Der Judenstaat” by Theodor Herzl, considered to be the father of modern Zionism starting with this book. “The idea which I have developed in this pamphlet is a very old one: it is the restoration of the Jewish State.” Herzl simply renewed the idea in modern times, so many websites will list him as the start. However, a little digging into Jewish history and you will find Zionism is a very old idea.
The idea is old but the specific movement and the execution of it is very young.
Zionists are primarily characterised by "the end justify the means" which mostly means they will kill and expell anyone they don't like.
Jews however want their promised land but not specifically by violent means.
After spending some time reading the history of Zionism, I find your characterization of them dishonest. There’s tons of early Zionists that preached pacifism and coexistence. Here’s one of many examples https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/A._D._Gordon
Only a white supremacist classifies people into "races" based on arbitrary bullcrap like "sharing specific DNA." Methinks you don't seem to know how white supremacism works - despite the fact that you see the world through it's lens. It's a pretty common symptom amongst sufferers of the particular disease we call "westernism."
No it didn't, Clyde. Again... it’s such non-controversial history you’ll even find it on wikipedia.
Race is the wrong word in the modern American context. Jews aren't a race in the sense of black vs white.
Jews are, however, an ethnicity - much like how you can be ethnically Navaho or ethnically Basque. It's a matter of being part of a community of people with a shared culture and ancestry. And yes, beta Israel and Ashkenazim are both ethnically Jewish.
That's really weird, Clyde... considering that it's the only understanding of "race" we have here in our fundamentally white supremacist society.
Do tell... what does the KKK and the neonazis think of your (supposedly) "nuanced" take on pseudo-scientific "race science?"
Race used to be commonly used as a synonym of ethnicity - it isn't rare to see references to the German race, the Celtic race, Greek race, etc.
Oh... so dividing people into "races" using the most arbitrary characteristics is a recent thing?
You don't say.
If westernism is a disease which region is the cure professor Tank
So not only don't you understand your own diseased ideology... you also completely miss the point of all the others.
No, Clyde... desperately hurling the term "tankie" at others does not distract from your white supreamcism.
Yes my horrible ideology of citing a peer reviewed science article published by the national library of medicine lmao. Science is a capitalist and imperialist conspiracy!!1!1
Again, Clyde… desperately hurling the term “tankie” at others does not distract from your white supreamcism.
As soon as you called westernism a disease I knew exactly what your profile would look like. You’re a tankie. If I called easternism a “disease” would that be okay? No because I’m not a bigot. If you’re old enough to be using this site you’re old enough to know better.
Hey, Clyde... here's a nice trick for you to try on your own. Every time somebody mentions the term "western civilization" to you, substitute the word "western" with the word white.
See if it changes the context - it's a very fun little game. And quite educational.
What "easternism," Clyde? There is no such thing "eastern civilization" underpinned by "yellow and/or brown supremacy" - it only exists in the fevered imaginations of white supremacists.
Let me guess... you have a black friend?
Again, Clyde… desperately hurling the term “tankie” at others does not distract from your white supremacism.
“What “easternism,” Clyde? There is no such thing “eastern civilization” underpinned by “yellow and/or brown supremacy” - it only exists in the fevered imaginations of white supremacists.”
This word vomit is incomprehensible to anyone who isn’t a Tankie. I don’t understand what you’re trying to say. If easternism isn’t a thing why would westernism be a thing?
No, no, no, Clyde... what "easternism?"
What's the matter? Afraid of following your own narrative to it's logical conclusion? Why would that be, eh?
Show it to me. Show me this "other" to your precious white - oops, sorry, I meant to say "western" - civilization that only exists in your head.
What are you even trying to say? You’re having an entire conversation with yourself and putting words in my mouth, it’s bizarre and hard to understand. I’m guessing westernism means the belief in western values and easternism would mean belief in eastern values.
There has never been more than one "western" value, Clyde - it's white supremacism. That's it. That's what makes something "western."
So I guess you won't be putting up any credible evidence to back up your silly claims?
No surprises there.
You are an actual racist
That's it?
That's all you have, Clyde?
Do tell... is this literally the first time you've been informed that the only thing that makes "western civilization" coherent in any way is white supremacism?
Yes, it is the first time I’ve been “informed” of such a concept. Only someone obsessed with race would come to that conclusion.
I hate to be the one to break it to you, Clyde... you live in a race-obsessed society. You wouldn't know what it is to exist outside of one.
You exist in a fundamentally white supremacist world - and it's so normal to you that you can't even see it.
How do we cure this horrifying disease known as the west comrade?
Do you have anything else you want to try and hide your white supremacism with? Or are we done here?
Comrade please how do we cure it why won’t you answer me
That's a no?
Are you trying to act like an asshole? Like.. cause you are.
TIL... it's the people running interference for genocidal white supremacist settler-colonialist states that aren't the assholes.
So edgy